Maria Da Graça Carvalho (Beja, 70 years) lived in Portugal in decades, although the crisis surpassed in just over ten hours. The Minister of Environment and Energy spent the morning on Tuesday, while the country was normalized. He is Professor of Energy and Climate Alterations of the University of Lisbon and, as Eurodiputada, participated in the Report on the Design of the European Electric Market and the Regulation of Protection against the Manipulation of the Wholesale Mercado de Energy. He believes that it is not time to evaluate financial compensation requests to Spain while the origin of the blackout is unknown, but it is coming to show more firmness against France to end the Iberian Energy Island. The interview was conducted on Friday at his office in Lisbon.
Ask. Is the Portuguese government satisfied with the information you are receiving from Spain?
Answer. We have constant contact. Today I have had a meeting with the Spanish minister. There is contact and cooperation between the ministers and between the Secretaries of State. We are happy with that collaboration, which includes the exchange of technical data of REN and Ree.
P. Is there any advance to clarify what happened?
R. Not yet. We know what are the first centers that were disconnected and the area, but we don’t even have the certainty that the problem has arisen there. We have to wait for data analysis. And we would like it to be as independent as possible. We know that network operators have technical knowledge and data, but we would like the European Agency for Independent Regulators and experts to participate.
P. Did distrust the interests of the system operators?
R. No no. There is a European mechanism to prevent regulators of affected countries from being part of the report, but this has been an innovative incident, in bad sense, and it is convenient that there are eyes of technicians who are not involved to analyze and help us understand.
P. Portugal closed the electricity imports of Spain ten days. Why was this decision made?
R. By caution and to see how it evolved. In those days there was no anomaly on the network and that is why. It is not yet total, it will be done in phases. We have asked REN to perform a gradual plan until normalization. I hope it is brief, but this reveals the importance of being connected. We were already aware that the price of electricity in the wholesale market with disconnection was going to rise. It was a precaution that had a cost, but if we connected prematurely and something happened, we could have another incident. We were cautious.
P. Would the blackout have been less serious if the Iberian Peninsula had more interconnections with France?
R. Certainly. The recovery would have been faster. We, when cutting the connection with Spain, were without any other. We have two centrals with black start [inicio autónomo] that had some difficulty in restarting the system. It took three hours and another, four. Then it was streamlined when we achieved Spain with the International Duero and achieved three islands. To restart, Spain used some of the connection with Morocco and especially that of France, which is little.
P. Why don’t Spain and Portugal achieve that France increases interconnections? And why Brussels fails to impose its objectives to reach 15%?
R. They are at 3%. so that the interconnections increase. This claim is always present in the Iberian summits. I think France does not have much interest because it has a lot of nuclear energy and does not accelerate our interconnections. The two governments are going to resume this issue with more force with the European Commission. This is not a bilateral or trilateral issue, it is a European issue. We are facing barriers to the domestic market, which is the pillar of European construction, and France, not supporting the speed with which we intended to build these interconnections, it is placing barriers to the domestic market. We will ask for support from the commission and request a meeting with France. This incident demonstrates the importance of interconnections for Europe. Now it would have been beneficial for us, but it can be in the opposite direction, as happened during the Russian gas crisis. The Iberian Peninsula had seven ports of liquefied natural gas and great renewable electricity potential, therefore it is a source of security for the supply of Europe, but we cannot send it because we have a very weak connection.
P. Does the barriers of France have to do with environmental motifs, but with competition with their nuclear?
R. There are environmental problems, but there are always solutions to mitigate them. Now we are building a high voltage line between Portugal and Spain and we have had to reorient it, in addition to compensating the populations, but we have found solutions because we are interested in strengthening that connection. Therefore, environmental problems can be solved with lower impact designs, but it is necessary to be motivated to find solutions and I do not see that motivation on the side of France because objectively they do not have much interest. They will have all the interest in the case of an energy crisis. The more connected the market is, the greater supply security we will have and the more ability to resist challenges before any international crisis.
P. Is Portugal to ask for economic compensation from Spain for the damages of the blackout?
R. At this time, our main objective is to understand. As long as we do not understand what happened, we will not address that issue. At the same time we work to prevent incidents of this nature and if it occurs, because it cannot be guaranteed that it does not happen, what measures can we take so that the recovery is faster. We take about ten hours to recover and we have been congratulated for that. Taking into account gravity, it was a fairly reasonable recovery, but still, we have to see how to recover faster. We have a group of independent specialists to plan and look to the future: how to avoid a blackout, how to recover better and how to plan our system so that it is better prepared for such an event. Although our network meets all European rules, but we are living an energy transition with the increase of renewables and decentralization and everything has to be well studied.
P.. Did it run too much and that has been able to introduce more instability in the system?
R. What happened is independent of technology. We no longer have coal centrals, it is an irreversible decision. Spain has nuclear and did not avoid the blackout. Now, it is better to have a balance between intermittent energy sources and stable sources. Fortunately, we have a lot of water and six combined cycle natural gas groups. We also need more storage and, luckily, we have many hydroelectric plants that can pump. Now we have made a PRR to develop batteries for the electrical system. We are making our system more resilient and safe. We will see the conclusions about the blackout, but the debate on technologies is not the one that matters at this time.
