The natural thing is to stay in government whoever is committed to Lula’s re-election, says Gleisi

The Minister of Institutional Relations, Gleisi Hoffmann, said that the promise of support for the re-election of President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva must enter the negotiation table with deputies who intend to maintain the nomination for positions in the federal government. The head of political articulation adds that the order is to dismiss the representatives of all parliamentarians who voted against the Provisional Measure alternative to the IOF. The minister also criticized the 15% interest rate maintained by the Central Bank led by Gabriel Galípolo, appointed to the post by Lula.

Will the government only have 193 deputies at the base from now on? It was the number of votes that the alternative MP to the IOF had in the Chamber.

No. We will have a larger base. We are going to bring in more deputies to complete, so we are reorganizing. Whoever voted against the Provisional Measure, which was in the country’s interest, cannot remain. He voted against the government.

The government has already started to fire nominees of deputies who voted against the MP. How many positions will these changes affect?

We are closing now. It’s a considerable number. We are considering all areas and institutions. Our orientation is to remove the nominees of deputies who voted against. Dismiss, and then we will reorganize the base. There has already been a setback with the IOF decree (overturned by Congress). As there was a recurrence, we have not only the right, but the duty to reorganize the base.

Within this reorganization, will the deputy who maintains the position have to support Lula in 2026?

First, you have to make a commitment to vote with us in the National Congress. Obviously it would be correct and natural to have a commitment to the president, since he is participating in the government. So, there is a commitment to the re-election of the president.

But will this be brought to the table?

We have to start talking about this with leaders and parliamentarians.

Can someone who lost their position go to the government and say that they will now vote in favor?

We have many deputies to talk to. Our first focus is on those who were not on the vote. Secondly, we can talk to some who may have regretted it, justified themselves and made a commitment from now on to vote on matters with the government.

Aren’t you afraid that these deputies who will be left without their positions will take a tougher opposition stance, further damaging the government?

But what are they going to do other than vote against the government as they are already voting?

Gilberto Kassab is president of the PSD, which has three ministries, and worked to defeat the MP. What did you think of the party’s position?

The PSD never fully supported the government. It always gave votes to the government, sometimes half the bench, sometimes more than half… Our position in relation to the PSD is to honor the deputies who are voting with the government.

The person who also acted to block the MP was the governor of São Paulo, Tarcísio de Freitas. Is this an attempt to weaken President Lula thinking about 2026?

Tarcisio’s stance has been regrettable. You would have to worry about São Paulo. This is the second or third intervention he has made in Brasília to try to defend his interests. There was a major intervention in the amnesty and it came to fruition. Now, again, operating against Brazil. What this governor is doing is a disservice.

Do you believe he will be your opponent in 2026?

It is difficult for us to predict who will be a candidate for President. We only have one certainty: Lula will be.

Do you see any party that wasn’t with Lula in 2022 and could be there now?

It is possible that we have parts of these parties supporting and not all of them. In 2022, for example, considerable parts of MDB and PSD have already supported it. I think this will happen again in 2026. We will work as hard as we can to bring the party together, creating a coalition. The Republicans and the PP will have parties with us. With União Brasil, for example, we have a joint campaign in Amapá and we can have it in Pará. This type of party arrangement to support Lula is quite possible.

Is the ticket likely to repeat itself with Geraldo Alckmin as vice-president?

Alckmin is an excellent deputy. We like him a lot, but obviously this depends on his conversation with the president and the parties. I’m not aware of that.

One year before the election, Lula has no defined platforms in the country’s two largest states, São Paulo and Minas Gerais. What are the paths discussed?

This is a discussion that takes place more within the party. It is very important that there is this construction of platforms. In Minas, the president has been talking a lot about Rodrigo Pacheco being the candidate for governor. He (Lula) is convinced that, if he is a candidate, (Pacheco) will be elected. In São Paulo, we have important names: (Fernando) Haddad, (Geraldo) Alckmin… The PT will not be left without a good platform.

What do you intend to do so that in a possible new term the relationship with Congress is not so tumultuous?

We have to make an effort so that President Lula’s vote can also be reflected in our tickets for the Chamber and Senate. There is only one way to have a fluid relationship with Congress: to have a majority from your political camp. If not, we will have to negotiate, and it will always be a more difficult relationship, but never a breakup. We may have disagreements and disputes, but Congress brought important results for the government and the country during this president’s term.

But there were also defeats, as in the case of the IOF and the MP…

We managed to approve important matters, such as income tax exemption, in the Chamber. Now, I believe that the Senate will not be missing from Brazil either. We approved the electricity measure, which exempts those who consume up to 80 KW. We had setbacks like the IOF issue, but I think the situation was worse for Congress than for the government from a political point of view. And now with MP 1303 (alternative to IOF). We want to have a calm relationship with Congress, but it has to be frank, objective and loyal.

How will you deal with the project to reduce sentences for those involved in 8/1, if it is put on the agenda?

We are against it. I have already spoken with presidents Hugo (Motta) and (Davi) Alcolumbre (in reference to the heads of the Chamber and Senate). We cannot stop people from going to the vote. The Houses have autonomy. We believe that it is a mistake to put it to a vote now, it will generate more wear and tear for the National Congress. If Congress wants to review sentences, it is legitimate, but it cannot be in the middle of a process and focused on this case.

In an interview with the BBC, former minister José Dirceu spoke about the possibility of former president Jair Bolsonaro serving a sentence under house arrest. What did you think?

Bolsonaro has to serve the sentence given by the sentence. Neither more nor less. It’s not up to us to give an opinion on Bolsonaro’s sentence

The government was against the Blindagem PEC, but PT deputies voted in favor. Doesn’t that get in the way?

It was unfortunate for these deputies.

There is pressure for the president to appoint a woman to the Federal Supreme Court, especially because when he took office there were two women. How do you, being a woman, see this?

This definition is from the President of the Republic. We have no room for our guesses.

The information is that the Senate wants Rodrigo Pacheco in the Supreme Court. Could the government’s relationship with the Senate suffer any damage if Pacheco was not chosen?

I say again: constitutionally, the decision rests with the President of the Republic. This is important to respect.

You were a harsh critic of Roberto Campos Neto at the Central Bank. Was there a disappointment with Gabriel Galípolo?

Roberto Campos Neto left this cursed legacy. He built the way for interest rates to become stratospheric. The Central Bank has autonomy. I always considered that we had to start a process of falling interest rates, that nothing justifies the 15% rate. It should be at 10%, 9%… It has no relation to our economic reality. Inflation is falling, the dollar is low, in other words, we are fully capable of making the reduction. I did expect the Central Bank to act differently. Let’s see how he behaves at the next meeting.

Would you use the word disappointment given the expectations that were created?

I had at least the expectation that they wouldn’t increase any further and we would start to see rates fall, but you can’t say it’s a disappointment. What the Central Bank is doing is bad for the country.

The government was accused of failing to comment on the Nobel Prize awarded to Venezuelan María Corina, an opponent of Nicolás Maduro. What is your assessment?

Why does the government have to speak out about this? What is the objective? You don’t need to speak out about everything that happens.